Township Council Minutes
February 26, 2002
The Regular Meeting of the Mount Olive Township Council was
called to order at 7:30pm by Council President Scapicchio
with the Pledge of Allegiance to the Flag.
MOMENT OF REFLECTION
President Scapicchio: If everyone would just join us. At
these Public Meetings, we now do a moment of reflection of
the men and women fighting terrorism and defending the freedom
that we all enjoy.
According to the Open Public Meetings Act, adequate Notice
of this Meeting has been given to the Mt. Olive Chronicle
and the Morristown Daily Record. Notice has been posted at
in the Municipal Building, 204 Flanders-Drakestown Road, Mt.
Olive, New Jersey, and notices were sent to those requesting
ROLL CALL: Present: Mr. Guenther, Mr. Greenbaum, Mrs. Miller,
Mr. Perkins, Mr. Rattner, Mr. Scapicchio, Mr. Spino
Proclamation by Mayor Licitra
Whereas this Proclamation is Honoring Lawrence E. Shaver.
Whereas on Saturday March 9, 2002 the Eagle Scout Community
will hold a ceremony to elevate Lawrence E. Shaver to the
rank of Eagle Scout.
Whereas Lawrence E. Shaver represents a rare two percent
of Scouts who attained this award; and
Whereas Lawrence E. Shaver Eagle Scout Project was a Public
School improvement project, which consisted of the construction
and installation of four picnic tables and the installation
of basketball nets and the reconditioning of the basketball
backboards within the outdoor playground area for the Mount
Olive Community; and
Whereas through his achievement he has shown leadership,
devotion to duty, and is an example of the best of our youth;
Whereas Mount Olive Township wishes to properly recognize
and commend Lawrence E. Shaver on this outstanding achievement.
Now Therefore be it Proclaimed that I, Paul R. Licitra, Mayor
of Mount Olive Township, do hereby Proclaim this Saturday
March 9, 2002 as Lawrence E. Shaver day in Mt. Olive Township.
Mayor Licitra: This will be presented to Lawrence Shaver
at his ceremony. I do invite the Council if they have not
already gotten their individual invitations to the ceremony.
It is usually a very good ceremony and as I said it is probably
the best of our youth. On a side note, in the two years that
I have been Mayor, I have been getting a lot of young people
coming into Town Hall asking about Eagle Projects. We have
probably been involved in at least four or five of them. The
list just continues to grow. This is quite an award and quite
an achievement for this young men. and I as an Administrator
know that Council supports every endeavor from the Scouts
of America. I thank you very much.
Appointment of Elisa Muller to the Open Space Committee -
Mayor=s Appt., 3 year term, Exp. 12/31/03
Mayor Licitra: I would like to make the Appointment of Elisa
Muller to the Open Space Committee.
President Scapicchio: Paul, do we have to take action for
Mayor Licitra: No.
President Scapicchio: Good. So now we have a full compliment
of members on that.
Safety Town Presentation - St. Clare's Hospital
President Scapicchio: From Saint Clare's Hospital we have
Melissa Nichols and Cynthia Lyons.
Mayor Licitra: Before this presentation is given if I may,
we have been in dialogue with these two young ladies, for
the last three or four months. Heather got involved as well
as Kathy Murphy on this project. It is a project that the
Township does endorse. They are going to talk to you about
land that was donated to us from Toys 'R' Us along with the
donation to the sports program that we were able to secure.
It is an endeavor that
I think is something Mt. Olive could strive for. There are
ongoing meetings that we are having both with the Freeholders
and the Parks Department, St. Clare's, our Township. It is
something that will probably be good not only for the Mount
Olive Township, but it is something that will probably be
good for the entire Morris County, so I as the Mayor of Mt.
Olive Support this project and if we could work something
out as far as available land which we are looking at right
now, I think it will benefit our Community very much. So thank
Cynthia Lewis: Good Evening. We have provided for the Council,
handouts of the slides that we were going to utilize, since
we don't want to inconvenience and put up an overhead. Our
endeavor is a Safety Town which is going to be dedicated to
children and safety. The Safety Town initiative came about
as a result of this Community Health Trust which is an affiliation
of St. Clare's Hospital. Several years ago, St. Clare's hospital
provided a survey to Morris and Sussex County. They identified
five areas of health improvement; cancer, heart disease and
stroke, tobacco, substance abuse and teen and youth issues.
One of the main goals of the teen and youth action team was
the safety of children. Included in that was initiative to
begin a Safety Town, which is basically an interactive children's
program that covers many aspects of safety. To fill you in
on Safely Town Project, Melissa Nichols, Manager of Community
Relations is going to take you through the slides.
Melissa Nicols: Thank you very much Council President and
Mayor for allowing us the opportunity to be here tonight.
As Cynthia said, Safety Town is a Safety Education Program
for children ages 3 through approximately 10. Obviously it
is a fluent age group depending on the understanding of children.
Why is Safety Town so important? First of all we wanted to
give you a national and local perspective. Over 1300 deaths,
many of which are related to bicycle accidents throughout
the country. 100,000 accidents resulting in emergency room
visits are results of inline skating. Those statistics aren't
related specifically to children, but we all know that children
are the greatest risk because they don't necessarily always
use the safety skills that are necessary. More specifically
on a local level, St. Clare's sees approximately 10 visits
per month for bike injuries. A few years back, Mt. Olive also
had very serious bicycle incident. This may hit home for some
of you very closely. We also see about two dog bites a month.
So in Budd Lake specifically, not including Flanders we experienced
228 visits from children in the Budd Lake area over a 10 month
period. So clearly on a local and national level, safety is
an issue for children in our Country, Mt. Olive and in Morris
County. What is Safety Town and why is it important? The mission
of Safety Town is to reduce the number of needless deaths
and accidents among our most valuable asset, our children.
The goal of this initiative is to create a permanent Safety
Town so we could teach our children the techniques for safety.
Safety Town is a national initiative. It is a popular non-profit
publicly funded program. The National Safety Town Center is
located in Cleveland, Ohio and there are a number of Safety
Towns throughout the country. There are two different types
of Safety Town. One is called stationary, one is mobile. The
mobile one literally is rolled out for a specific period of
time. There are a few of those in New Jersey. For instance
Rockaway Township has a Mobile Safety Town that they roll
out primarily for their kindergartners in the summer before
they start school. Literally they take over their parking
lot, they roll out a mat that has these safety stations on
it, and they take their kids through it. Through the Community
Health Chest, we surveyed all the Morris and Sussex County
Superintendents and they all whole heartily endorsed the idea
of a permanent Safety Town. The reason being that in order
to truly get a comprehensive formal safety education, you
need an investment in a permanent Safety Town where you can
actually develop it on an ongoing basis, and actually have
the space to dedicate to the skills that you need to teach.
More Specifically, Safety Town is a Safety and Education Training
program, interactive hands on, again it is for children ages
Pre-K through about 10. It is set in a park like setting.
It is child size. It is actually a town. We are looking at
about four or five acres of property. Where if you see to
your left, I know it is a little far away from you. That's
very very conceptual, because until we have any land dedicated
to the project, obviously our architect can't really design
the park to reflect the land. Basically you walk through it,
them they call them names like Careful Corner, & Traffic
Lane, they walk though it and they go to different safety
stations. There are volunteers there who teach the children
different safety tips. There are actually real buildings there.
It varies from Safety Town to Safety Town, depending on how
we want to design it. Most of the buildings that exist at
Safety Town are child size, meaning children could walk inside,
adults would have to stoop pretty low to get inside. Most
of the buildings are also sponsored by national corporations
like Home Depot, Toys R Us. McDonalds Foundation. Primarily
because they not only have a commitment to safety programs,
but it is also wonderful Public Relations for them, and they
obviously supply a lot of in kind services. It is very exciting
and has certainly been well endorsed by a lot of companies
throughout the country. One of our models that we have been
looking at to kind of forge our way through this path has
been Pasco Safety Town in Florida. That is a stationary Safety
Town. It was primarily done through a community initiative.
The way Safety Town works in Pasco, which is the way we would
be proposing it for Morris County in that it would be primarily
used by the school systems. Both in Morris, Sussex and probably
Warren depending on where the location may be. We would arrange
it just like a school trip. Teachers who want to sign up their
kids for a field trip to Safety Town would do so. That would
be our first and foremost priority for schools to use it.
Secondary, would be an organization like the Boy Scouts, Girl
Scouts, any kind of children's group, the Boys Club/Girls
Club of America. Basically the intent is to educate as many
kids and to keep them as safe as
possible. In Pasco County the average number of students
is about 100 per day that go through the park. New Jersey,
being the most populated State in the Country, our numbers
are a little higher, specifically for Sussex, Morris, and
Warren there is about 54,000 kids kindergarten to fifth grade.
We are going to get into the presentation little bit more,
but just to give you an idea how far along or not is this
process, we wanted to kind of sketch out to you our faces
for development because the project has really taken on quite
a bit of steam and we are very excited about it. The first
phase which is one reason why we are here, is to initiate
some public awareness and to hopefully raise your awareness
about the need for Safety Town and hopefully generate your
support. We are identifying and organizing our honorary Steering
Committees, we are proud to say that Sheriff Rochford, the
Morris County Sheriff, has agreed to be our honorary Chair.
Freeholder director, John Murphy has also agreed to serve
on the Honorary Committee, and we have a very very active
Steering Committee which is working very hard to get this
initiative up in the air. Obviously in Phase I, another reason
why we are here is to identify property, and to also begin
curriculum development. There has been basically with a project
this size, when your are really talking about how important
and big it is, a lot of things have to happen at the same
time. So for instance, we need to identify land in order to
continue to generate support, but in order to really get the
buy in from our school systems, we need to have a solid curriculum.
We really need to show that this is a true Safety education
program, where there will be measurable results and hopefully
improved outcomes, meaning less injury among our kids. We
are developing our funding strategies and developing our time
line in phase two, which hopefully we will get to quicker
rather than slower. We hope to acquire the property, plan
and development the site, and finalize the curriculum, refine
our budget, secure fundraising as always, recruit skilled
labor, and then ultimately to phase three and phase four which
will be groundbreaking construction, hiring an onsite coordinator,
the outreach of marketing of Safety Town to schools and other
offices, media, etc, getting the equipment and recruiting
the volunteers. Most of Safety Towns throughout the country
are run by volunteers. They all have at least one paid coordinator
for the most part, all of the stationary ones, and then the
rest of the whole program is run by volunteers, which is really
what we want to try to do. The best way to do it, the best
way to get the volume from the Community and hopefully to
be most successful. Finally in phase four, we have a grand
opening and our kids will be able to start going through it.
Part of phase four of course is the development of ongoing
measurement tool and keys for success. Now more specifically
about the learning stations, what is so unique about Safety
Town, is that it really becomes our Safety Town. Clearly the
issues that we face here in Morris and Northwest, NJ are not
the same that they face in Brower County Florida. For instance
in Pasco Safety Town they had donated a 32ft. ship that they
simulated to rock as if something hit it and it was sinking.
The kids get on the boat, they get their life jackets on,
and they have to safely get off the boat. So they have gotten
very very creative and very very exciting with their Safety
Stations. They also have alligator safety which I think we
could safely pass up. I'm not sure about that. What Safety
Town really becomes, is our Safety Town with the local issues
that we have in our Community based on our own Emergency room
visit staff, based on what the schools are telling us, based
on what our kids our telling us, and what we see in our own
homes. Some of the consistent core learning stations are Police,
where they teach you about stranger danger; fire, stop, drop
and roll; parks and recreation, what to do how to swing properly
or how to fall safely. There are ways to fall without the
breaking of your wrist. Road safety, how to cross the road
safely, how to use a road sign. Road Safety would also include
train safety, how to cross safely over train tracks. Sports
and games. This is somewhat of a catch all meaning sports
and games would classify scooter safety, which is obviously
a big issue that ten years ago people weren't thinking about.
Although now, it is on the top of everyone's mind, so that
would probably fall under sports and games. Household safety
& poison control; how to identify poisons under your kitchen
sink. How to keep yourself safe in the house, which could
also include electrical safety to some capacity. Animal safety.
That could range anything from what to do when you see a bear
to how to identify tick bites. So again, it's very fluent,
it is something that you own as a community where you really
identify and we don't expect it to stay stagnant. Some of
the course stations probably will, but what they teach at
those stations will probably change. But we also expect over
time as issues change it will develop new stations, or have
kind of temporary stations. Things that address issues for
a six month period if you will. There will be special events.
I am sure we will have once or twice a year, car seat safety
for children. We feel for Safety Town to be most utilized,
that it include a building that could be used for community
education throughout the whole year. Since we are a seasonal
environment, Safety Town for our purposes could probably only
be used nine months out of the year, if nine months. We felt
that if we are going to be this big of an initiative that
we needed to be able to use to all year round. So that Community
Center would be used for things possible like internet safety,
and other kind of Household indoor type of safety issues that
are important to our children. Why are we here tonight? The
Mayor made reference to it. Two things. First of all I am
a resident so I am a little bias, but I do think Mt. Olive
is a premier residential Community and it has come so far,
it is so developed particularly with it's corporate community
partnership. It's good location, easy access, as suburban
sprawl continues to move west the center of Morris County.
Mt. Olive once again becomes the center of the County. It
is very youth oriented. Lot of kids in Mt. Olive. One of the
benefits we think to having it in Mt. Olive would be that
certainly any costs that would be associated with any of the
other school systems going through Safety Town would be waived.
The Safety Town would be completely free for Mount Olive residents
and their children. It would obviously be a benefit to Mt.
Olive Children because it is located here, more than likely
most of your young people will go through it more than anyone
else, so hopefully you'll see
here in Mt. Olive a decrease in any injuries to your children.
So those are a few reasons. Back about a year ago, what really
prompted us to start to look closely at Mt. Olive was the
Turkey Brook Recreation Complex.
It has been in the news so much. It is very exciting, kind
of progressive type of park. We thought so much land, a few
acres here and there won't matter. Since then, we have actually
had conversation with Heather Stewart and Kathy Murphy, both
of whom were a great help. We've identified a couple other
parcels of land in Mount Olive that we think might be viable.
Again, it is obviously up to the Council, the Township and
the Community to decide if that is something that they want
for Mt. Olive. That is one reason why we ended up here. We
also of course like everyone else are looking at the Greystone
Property and we did meet with Freeholder Director John Murphy
and gave him an update on the project as well. That is a possibility
that exists, but again can't get any commitment from anyone
for a few months or certainly some time. So we are looking
at Greystone, we are looking at Mount Olive, we our looking
at Jefferson Township; there are some possibilities there.
But ideally, land is very hard to come to in Morris County,
and we think this project is a win win for everybody. Not
only for the Community which gets to house it but for the
entire counties in which we serve which will be Morris, Sussex
and Warren. Ultimately protecting our children is what is
most important and I think everyone can share that goal and
certainly come around it. We are hopeful that the last slide
that we have is how could we work together. First and foremost
we certainly want to thank you again for giving us the opportunity
to share with you this very exciting initiative. We hope we
have raised your awareness, not only about how important it
is, but raise your interests and excitement about the idea
of it coming to Mount Olive. Second, we hope that you will
give some serious consideration to the possibility of some
four or five acres in Mt. Olive that would be a good fit for
this program. Third and finally, we hope that we've inspired
you so much that maybe you or someone you know will want to
join our Steering Committee. We are always looking for people
who have the time which I know none of you probably do, but
you might know someone who is active in the Mt. Olive School
District who thinks this is a good program and would like
to be involved and with that we will be happy to answer any
questions. We hope that it was certainly informative.
Mr. Rattner: The St. Claire's Health Services. What is the
actual relationship or contractual agreements with St. Claire's?
Ms. Nicols: The Community Health Trust is its own technically
non-profit, but it is administered by St. Claire's, so that
is the relationship with the Community Health Trust which
Cynthia went over in the beginning in terms of their initiative
for Safety Town. In terms of the operational structure for
Safety Town, the Steering Committee was just discussing this.
Most of the Safety Towns throughout the Country create their
own Safety Town 501 3c their own Safety Town Non-Profit foundation
may still be couched as part of the St. Clare's Health Services
System, that's yet to be determined, there is no distinction.
For instance, in Pasco Safety Town they run their program
all through the Sheriffs Office, and we did mention that to
the Sheriff. Although I don't think that is where we necessarily
want to go, maybe a partnership between the hospital and the
Sheriff's Office, kind of the Management of the program possibly,
looking for a grant funded coordinator position that would
manage the Safety Town foundation. The relationship between
this initiative and St. Claire's in a greater sense is about
our mission. Hospitals try to keep people healthy. We certainly
want to do our part on a larger community health, public health
Mr. Rattner: I guess what I was getting to is looking at
that, it sounds like an aggressive program. We are not talking
about construction costs, but just to operate, what do you
feel, the way it is pictured up on there, and one of the locations
you are talking about. What would be the operating Budget
to make that work?
Ms. Nicols: We are still assessing that. The problem, looking
at a place like Pasco Florida is that they have none of the
same costs that a place like Morris County has. That is probably
next on our agenda to really get to an operational budget,
but the Pasco Safety Town is run primarily through donations
and grants. I know in light of recent budget cuts and where
we are as a state, grants are hard to come by, for sure. We're
optimistic that the initiative will be so well received that
we'll be able to manage to get those dollars on an operational
basis. I can't commit the hospital to that kind of commitment
at his point if that is what you are looking for.
Mr. Rattner: It sounds like a great plan, you know the presentation
is good, but I guess trying to figure out how big a program
is it really going to be. You're looking for the field of
dreams and they will come? Or do you have an idea of saying
we want to serve this many people and this is the type of
facility we are going to build?
Ms. Nicols: Generally, we would start small. I think probably
four days a week. There would be charges to the schools that
use it. There would certainly be a field trip fee as there
is when they go anywhere, Waterloo, you have to pay a fee.
That maintenance fee would go in hand with paying for the
operational costs. All of the building construction and things
of that nature we are fairly confident that we will be able
to get though in kind donations. So in terms of once those
fees are met, operation will continue to be a struggle, but
I think through the revenue we will bring in through the schools,
and what I did want to mention is that we also hope
at one point, once a month or even once a week, to open it
up to the community. This is the Community Safety Town. Not
everyone may have the opportunity to go through their school
or their organization so maybe for a few hours every Saturday,
parents could just walk up to the park with their kids, assuming
works out. It is open but there would be a fee for that as
well. There is a fee structure involved in attendance to it.
President Scapicchio: Correct me if I am wrong, during your
presentation I thought you said it was free to the children
of Mount Olive.
Ms. Nicols: Yes. If we were to have it here, it would be
free for Mt.Olive, but the other school districts that would
be using it would not be. That would be hopefully one perk,
to have it here. Again, if I could I would like to just bring
this up. One of the ideas, Safety Town again is a park like
setting, there is no intention to have a fence around the
whole park. If it's not open per say, hours aren't open, people
should still be able to enter and walk around, and see it.
It is not fenced in. It is not closed off. You see this cross
walk that is here and again this is just conceptual. One of
the ideas that we have in terms of really making it a grass
roots community based program is to offer parents to bring
their kids in and for a certain fee, put their handprints
down, so across the whole park, you would have handprints
of kids and kind of a pledge if you would to safety from and
their parents, so there is a lot of excitement and a lot of
flexibility that we have here.
President Scapicchio: Melissa, is there a financial commitment
being asked for on behalf of the Township or are we just being
asked to. I have a memo in front of me that suggests that
you have identified a piece of property and there is the potential
for the Township to swap this particular piece of property
for a piece of property that the County owns.
Ms. Nichols: Russ Felter who is the director of the land
and trails acquisition program has been active on our Steering
Committee and certainly commits to nothing. He has raised
this with the Park Commission and we are actually doing the
presentation for them on April 9, 2002. I think if there is
a way the County could endorse this program and the Township
to where that is a win win for everybody, I think they would
be willing to look into it, but no commitments have been made
by any parties.
President Scapicchio: Does this program require a financial
commitment on behalf of Mount Olive Township?
Ms. Nichols: I do not see one. I don't think there is.
President Scapicchio: So really what you are asking us for
is a piece of property and an endorsement of the program itself.
We are being asked to make no financial commitment in terms
of maintenance, staff, construction costs or anything of that
Ms. Nichols: No. Absolutely not. The one idea that came up
in our Steering Committee meeting was the possibility if we
are able to get a grant funded position or even if it is half
grant and half supplied in some other way. The coordinator
for this program could work with Mount Olive in their Recreation
Department and service them.
President Scapicchio: I just wanted to make the suggestion
that there has been a piece of property that has been identified
here next to Toy's R Us. Are you aware of it.
Ms. Nichols: Yes. We went and saw it actually. It is beautiful
for this project. It is flat.
President Scapicchio: I guess the next step would be to find
out whether that piece of property really meets your requirements.
Ms. Nichols: That would be the next step as far as were concerned,
but we certainly wanted to be here first before we went further.
Mayor Licitra: I have a meeting on Friday with Russ Felter,
The Parks Commission. We are going to discuss those avenues.
Of coarse it is premature now as far a the swap is concerned,
but there are other properties in Towns that we may be able
to swap with them, and also the enticing part again is our
commitment to the teenagers in this Town, is to have someone
on staff that we can use that would aid our recreation department.
I think it is just a win win for us at this point. So I think
what we are looking for is a commitment to go forward. We
could all bring back a report probably in about two months
from now. See what their interest is and see what our interest
is, and I think at that point we will be ready to make a decision
to go forward.
President Scapicchio: My feeling Council would be, if we
are not being asked to make any kind of a financial commitment,
the program has some interest on my part.
Ms. Nichols: Great. We certainly welcome that.
President Scapicchio: Why don't you folks do your due diligence
with the Mayor and the Park Commission, see if the property
that has been identified meets the needs.
Ms. Nichols: We appreciate that. Thank you very much.
President Scapicchio: Thank you.
PUBLIC COMMENT PERIOD
President Scapicchio: That brings us to our Public Comment
Period. For those in the audience that aren't usually in attendance
here, the Council has expanded the Public Portion of our Public
Meetings to include a Public Comment Period at both the beginning
and the end. I would just simply note that there are probably
some people in the audience that want to talk about the Turkey
Brook Park bid discussions. That is going to be discussed
later on in this meeting. There is probably also some residents
here from Schoolhouse that are interested in an Ordinance
for First Reading. That is also later on. So with that I will
open the meeting to the Public for any comments. Seeing none.
We will close the first Public Portion of the meeting.
Sherry Jenkins: Gene is here this evening, so I just wanted
him to update the Council on a memo that Mr. Rattner sent
regarding Morris Companies if that is okay?
Gene Buczynski: Thank you. Regarding Morris Companies, we
have been dealing with them constantly, going back and forth
on issues, and right now I am waiting for him a map from Ed
Secco who did an as built map within the Trade Zone. He has
unfortunately been out of commission the last couple weeks
the last couple of weeks because of a back problem. I am waiting
for him to get back into his office, and he is going to give
me a copy of the map. We supplied Morris Company with all
the information we had available to them. I know they contacted
Lee Purcell asking them for some additional information and
basically he referred it back to the Town.
Mr. Rattner: I think that is the fourth time in a year that
they have asked the same stuff.
Mr. Buczynski: No, this is different. This is regarding the
size of the lines going into the plant which we don't have.
I can't give him information that I don't have. MSA would
have that. Lee Purcelll would have that map going into the
Sewage Authority. That is why I think he referred it back
to them. I could give him information to a point, but if we
don't have it in the Town, I can't provide it for him. The
other items previous were regarding the sewer service area
which they have to contact MSA in another town. I think as
far as us proceeding with what we are trying to give them
a little bit of information he still needs relative to the
size of the sewer lines going towards MSA. That is all I have
Mr. Rattner: When the MSA gets the calls, most of the time
they say it has been referred there. They'll tell you anything
trying to get information. That's just why I wanted to pass
it along as quick as possible so at least we get it done right.
I don't think anybody has any aversion to more development
in that area to get some rateables that won't affect the Town
and we just want to make sure it keeps moving.
President Scapicchio: Other administrative matters? Sherry?
Mrs. Jenkins: No that's it.
APPROVAL OF MINUTES OF PREVIOUS MEETINGS:
January 15, 2002 Present: Mr. Guenther, Mr. Greenbaum, Mrs.
Mr. Rattner, Mr. Scapicchio, Mr. Spino.
Absent: Mr. Perkins
February 12, 2002 CS Present: Mr. Guenther, Mrs. Miller,
President Scapicchio, Mr. Perkins, Mr. Greenbaum, Mr. Spino,
February 19, 2002 CS Present: Mr. Guenther, Mrs. Miller,
President Scapicchio, Mr. Perkins, Mr. Greenbaum, Mr. Spino,
Mr. Guenther moved for the approval of Minutes and Mrs. Miller
seconded that motion.
ROLL CALL: Passed Unanimously with the exception of Mr. Perkins
who abstained on January 15 and February 12, 2002.
Letters From Residents
1. Letter received February 12, 2002 from Colleen Labow regarding
the appointed position available the Open Space Committee.
Communications from Other Countries
2. Letter received February 12, 2001 from the Consulate General
of the People's Republic of China regarding Resolution 295-2001,
Falun Gong Practice.
Resolution, Ordinances, Correspondences from Other Municipalities
3. Letter received February 12, 2002 from the Washington
Township Department of Public Works regarding clarification
of Township policies and responsibilities.
4. Letter received February 20, 2002, from the Township of
Chester regarding Notice of Hearing of Application for preliminary
and final major sub-division approval (property fronting on
Four Bridges Road).
5. Resolution received February 21, 2002, from the Borough
of Mt. Arlington regarding a Resolution in Support of Assembly
Bill A 1420 which would establish a three year time limit
on a building permit.
6. Five Ordinances received February 22, 2002 from the Township
of Chester regarding Land Use.
League of Municipalities
7. E-mail received on February 18, 2002 from the NJ State
League of Municipalities regarding Emergency Public Safety
and Insurance Cap Exception (A-624/S-906).
8. Legislative Bulletin received February 22, 2002, from
the New Jersey State League of Municipalities regarding Bills
that were enacted as Public Laws of 2001.
9. Letter received February 11, 2002, from Musconetcong Sewerage
Authority regarding Gallonage Request for the Morris Companies.
10. Minutes received February 11, 2002 from the Musconetcong
Sewerage Authority regarding the January 9, 2002 meeting.
11. Newsletter received February 12, 2002 from the Council
on Affordable Housing regarding 10 year bill signed by Governor,
Council News, Second Round certifications extended to three
Municipalities and Rule Changes Proposed by COAH.
DOT / DEP / Permit's /LOI's
12. Letter received February 11, 2002, from Ferriero Engineering,
Inc. regarding NJDEP Stream Encroachment Permit and General
Permit No. 11 Applicant : American Instants, Inc. Block 6801,
4 & 5 (Bartley Road)
13. Letter received February 12, 2002 from Environmental
Technology Inc. regarding Request for Stream Encroachment
Permit and Statewide General No. 11 Applicant: American Instants,
Inc. Block 6801,
Lots 4 & 5 (117 Bartley Road)
14. Letter received February 12, 2002 from the State of New
Jersey Department of Environmental Protection regarding Letter
of Interpretation - Footprint of Disturbance Applicant: Academy
for Brighter Children / Ms. Aimee Krewinski Block 6900; Lot
19 (6 Bartley Chester Rd.)
15. Letter received February 12, 2002 from The Morris County
Department of Public Works regarding Price Schedule for vegetative
16. Letter received February 19, 2002 from the State of New
Jersey Department of Environmental Protection regarding notification
of a discharge of hazardous substances from the underground
storage tank(UST) systems at Kartar Corporation SUNOCO Service
Station - 341 Route 46. Block 7702; Lot 44.
17. Letter received February 19, 2002 from the State of New
Jersey Department of Environmental Protection
regarding a Proposed Amendment to the Mt. Olive Wastewater
Management Plan Upper Raritan Water Quality Management Plan
(WQMP) Block: 7801, LOT: 41, Gen III Builders Development.
18. Letter received February 19, 2002 from Handex regarding
a Construction Dewatering Request for an Authorization Certification
Form for the Texaco Station on Route 46.
19. Letter received February 21, 2002, from Yannaconne, Villa
& Aldrich, LLC regarding Stream Encroachment Application
for Russo Property Block 6900, Lot 26 (Bartley Road).
Correspondence from Legislative Representatives
20. Letter received on February 19, 2002 from Senator Littell
regarding NJ residents' awareness whom live in towns that
have high hazard dams.
Correspondence from Organizations / Committees / Boards
21. Letter received February 13, 2002 from the Budd Lake
Fire Department regarding the request for two additional full
time Communication Dispatchers.
22. Preliminary Equalization Table received February 19,
2002, from the Morris County Board of Taxation.
23. Letter received February 21, 2002, from Morris County
Community Development regarding Water Tank refurbishing and
24. Letter received February 11, 2002 from Comcast regarding
changes for customers of Northwest New Jersey.
President Scapicchio stated that we had 24 items of correspondence
on the agenda and asked if Council had any comments on same.
Mr. Rattner: I thought it was interesting we got our first
communications from other countries which was due to our presentation
from that one group that wanted to take a stand on basically
religious freedom in China. I thought it was interesting that
President Bush was just there in the last couple of days.
In there premiere I think tried telling Bush the same thing,
that we have always had religious freedom and that type of
thing. So I thought it was interesting, but it was enough
where the Peoples Republic of China responded to our resolution.
ORDINANCES FOR PUBLIC HEARING
Ord. #3-2002 An Ordinance of the Township Council of the
Township of Mount Olive Establishing Salaries of the Department
Heads, Supervisory and Certain Non-Union Personnel and for
the Employees of the Township Clerk's Office for the Year
2002. (Salary Adjustments for the Tax Collector & Building
Inspector & DPW Director)
President Scapicchio opened the hearing to the Public on
Ord. #3-2002. He states just so that the Public knows this
is a Salary Adjustment for three employees, Tax Collector,
Building inspector and Director of Public Works and the salary
increase are contractual which means they were agreed to at
the time of the employ or their promotion. Sherry is that
Mrs. Jenkins: Yes.
President Scapicchio: Seeing none? Close the Public Hearing.
ROLL CALL: Passed Unanimously
Mr. Ratter moved for Adoption and Final Passage of Ord. #3-2002
and Mr. Spino seconded the motion.
President Scapicchio declared Ord. #3-2002 as passed on second
ORDINANCES FOR FIRST READING
Ord. #7-2002 An Ordinance of the Township of Mount Olive
to Amend and Supplement Chapter 400 Entitled "Land Use"
to Modify the Requirements for Residential Cluster Development
and to Eliminate in its Entirety Certain Discretionary Standards
for Rural Residential Development.
Mr. Greenbaum moved that Ord. #7-2002 be introduced by Title
and Passed on First Reading and that a meeting be held on
March 26, 2002 and Mrs. Miller seconded that motion.
President Scapicchio: Council Discussion? Seeing none.
ROLL CALL: Passed Unanimously.
Ord. #8-2002 An Ordinance of the Township Council of the
Township of Mount Olive Amending and Supplementing Ordinance
No. 08-97, Which Granted Municipal Consent for the Renewal
of the Cable Franchise of TRK Cable Company of Morris. (cable
access channel) and Passed on First Reading and that a meeting
to be held on March 26, 2002 and Mrs. Miller seconded the
President Scapicchio: Council Discussion?
Mr. Spino: Is this for renewal of cable?
Mrs. Lashway: No. This is for cable access. It is amending
the last Ordinance that we did which renewed the franchise.
President Scapicchio: Mayor with regard to this Ordinance,
it seemed to me that they were supplying us with some community
access equipment that we may have figured into the Budget.
Could we have the Administration look into that?
Mr. Dorsey: I don't think that's correct. What they are providing
is a Public Access Channel.
President Scapicchio: Equipment as well. I read it.
Mr. Dorsey: Maybe equipment comes with it, but this is essentially
them providing the Public Access Channel.
Mrs. Jenkins: There is equipment that we have to purchase
for this, and yes it is in the budget.
President Scapicchio: I know that, but when I read it they
were also supplying, I don't know whether they called it a
coder, whatever it was it was something for us to be able
to put the letters on the bottom of the screen in this Township
Rob Greenbaum: This is what we discussed on Emergency Broadcast
Mayor Licitra: Sandy was working on this for the longest
Steve Rattner: One thing I am going to check into before
the Public Hearing is that according to this Ordinance, we
are giving him 10 years, from basically now. If I remember,
I thought when we renewed their franchise it was for 10 years.
There was a lot of discretion because we were thinking about
doing it for a lot less. I was just wondering if this is extending
their current franchise past that?
Mrs. Lashway: We did it for 10 years. The only thing that
this Ordinance is doing is providing for that cable access.
Steve Rattner: It says that this shall expire on January
23, 2012. That is 10 years from now. If we passed this a couple
years ago they don't have 10 years left. I am not prepared
to extend it, because once they have it, for. The only chance
we ever get at the cable company is when they come in and
they need something. I am not saying that it is definitely
wrong, I just realize that and we'll have to go back. I think
we passed it a few years ago and it may only have seven years
left, six years left, lets not give them any extra time as
a bonus just because they took over. The service is not that
President Scapicchio: Thanks Steve. Sherry, just to bring
to your attention for later, Section 7 of this Ordinance.
In here it says that the company shall provide the Township
with non-commercial PG programming upstream on the cable system
in addition the company shall purchase a character generator
for the purpose of allowing it to deliver the text message
to subscribers. I just want to make sure that we are not buying
something that they are going to supply us with. Any other
Council discussion? Seeing none.
ROLL CALL: Passed Unanimously with the exception of Mr. Spino
who voted no.
Ord. #9-2002 An Ordinance of the Township of Mount Olive
Prohibiting Parking at Certain Times on SchoolHouse Lane,
Corey Road, Patlyn Road and Jocynda Road. - C. Miller
Mrs. Miller moved that Ord. No. 9-2002 be introduced by Title
and Passed on First Reading and that a meeting held on March
26, 2002 and Mr. Guenther seconded the motion.
Mr. Greenbaum: I just think that it would be prudent to specifically
notify the School Board that we intend on discussing this
on February 26, 2002. I know that it is published in the newspaper,
but I think a letter should be sent to the School Board none
President Scapicchio: Lisa, will you take care of this?
Mrs. Lashway: Yes.
President Scapicchio: Any other Council Comments?
ROLL CALL: Passed Unanimously.
President Scapicchio: For the people that live on that road
that are in attendance, there will be a Public Hearing on
this March 26, 2002. At that time you will have an opportunity
to tell us what your thoughts are with regards to that ordinance,
and we understand the situation that is there. You all will
be real happy when this is passed.
CONSENT RESOLUTIONS AGENDA:
Resolutions on the Consent Agenda List are considered to
be routine and non-controversial by the Township Council and
will be approved by one motion (one vote). There will be no
separate discussion or debate on each of these resolutions
except for the possibility of brief clarifying statements
that may be offered. If one or more Council member requests,
any individual resolution on the Consent Agenda may be removed
from the Consent Agenda List and acted on separately.
1. Resolution of the Township Council of the Township of
Mount Olive Retaining Fred Detoro as the Township's Fire Sub
Resolution of the Township Council of the Township of Mount
Olive Authorizing the Mayor to Sign the Statement of Consent,
Section A-1 Consent in Connection with the MSA'S Application
to Expand its Wastewater Treatment Facility.
2. Resolution of the Township Council of the Township of
Mount Olive Authorizing a Refund of $730.50 in Construction
Permit Fees to Frank Carrell and Doreen Stanton. (ADA construction)
3. Resolution of the Township Council of the Township of Mount
Olive Authorizing a Developer's Agreement for Tariq Mahmood
for Building No. 3.
4. Resolution of the Township Council of the Township of
Mount Olive Requesting Approval of the Director of the Division
of Local Government Services to Establish a Dedicated Trust
by Rider for Accumulated Absences.
5. Resolution of the Township Council of the Township of
Mount Olive Approving Professional Service Contracts for the
Township Attorney, Municipal Engineer, Real Estate Consultant,
Labor Counsel, Municipal Environmental Consultant, Tax Map
Consultant, Community Planning Consultant and Appraisal/Assessing
Consultant for the Year 2002.
6. Resolution of the Township Council of the Township of
Mount Olive Authorizing the Sale of Certain Items, Which are
No Longer Needed for Public Use by the Township.
Mr. Spino moved for the Adoption of the Resolutions No.1
though No. 7 and Mr. Guenther seconded that motion.
President Scapicchio: Public Comment on any of the Resolutions
1 through 7.
Richard Bonte, Budd Lake, NJ: Could somebody explain Resolution
Mrs. Jenkins: Resolution No. 5 allows us to establish a dedicated
trust fund whereby we could set up an annual budget appropriation
for payouts for employees when they retire, transfer that
money into the trust fund and accumulate it for payout purposes.
Mr. Bonte: Where will that money come from?
Mrs. Jenkins: It will come from the annual budget. There
will be an appropriation established for it.
Mr. Bonte: Additional taxes on the Taxpayer, for these future
Mrs. Jenkins: We make payouts now.
Mr. Bonte: I understand that.
Mr. Greenbaum: It is either pay now or pay later. I understand
Mr. Bonte: What guarantees will there be that absolutely
nothing else can be done with this money in the future by
a change in the Ordinance whereby this fund may grow larger
than is anticipated to meet the payout needs in the future
and used for other projects and could be changed by Ordinance?
Mrs. Jenkins: There is a local finance notice that was prepared
by the Division of Local Government Services that specifically
sets forth the number of procedures that have to be followed
by myself and by the Council in order release funds for payout
Mr. Bonte: I am speaking to a diversion of funds at some
point in the future. Should the fund level build up to a point
that far exceeds what you think you may need for payouts?
Do you follow what I am saying?
Mrs. Jenkins: I follow what you are saying.
President Scapicchio: I guess the question is; would this
Council be able to finalize funds that are in that account
for other purposes other than salaries?
Mr. Bonte: Well, not even for salaries. This is for payout.
Mr. Guenther: Accumulated leave.
Mr. Bonte: No, it is not accumulated leave from what I understand.
Mrs. Jenkins: It is payout upon retirement and that payout
is established I believe it is by contractor. Upon retirement
there are certain employees that would be entitled to accumulated
sick time and or accumulated vacation time.
Mr. Spino: Why would we make it bigger than what we need,
especially for this. This is to save us from doing it in one
Mr. Bonte: Many years ago, I would say at least five years
ago, myself and Tom Tarn recommended to this Council when
we were doing an analysis of the sanitation budget that, why
are we not now on an annual basis putting into this fund,
sick leave time and unused vacation time.
Mr. Spino: Legislation did not allow it. This legislation
Mr. Bonte: You are going to, I presume, use some type of
actual table to make a determination as to how much money
should go into this fund annually?
Mrs. Jenkins: Right now, in our audit, every year the Auditors
are required to disclose what our crude liability is in terms
of vacation time and also sick time. Ideally, it would be
almost impossible to establish in one given year's budget
that full amount.
Mr. Bonte: You mean to bring it up to date.
Mrs. Jenkins: Exactly, to bring it up to date.
Mr. Bonte: But is your intent here to do two things. First,
start meeting your current annual liabilities as well as make
up whatever the anticipated liability is for what you have
not put in. What is the intent in terms of the amount of dollars
you expect to start putting in this fund on an annual basis?
Has that been identified to the Council?
Mr. Rattner: This year the intent is just to set it up and
it is going to be minimal because we have three or four retirements
that we already know about and why it was brought up. We asked
the CFO to look into it again, because to hit on the budget
this year is very great. We have one person with a lot of
accumulated time. We probably have another two next year.
The idea is not to have that fully funded as you would say
with a pension where whatever the Ordinance say we have $1,000,000.00
or whatever it is and that liability, but just enough so we
have it so we have a place to draw some of the cash. I don't
think we are ever going to get to the point that we are going
to cover it all. We just want to put it in there. If I looked
at this year, we'd be lucky to be able to find $10,000.00
to put it in there. It is just to get it started. The average
person may end with getting $15,000 - $20,000. I don't know
what the number really is, but it's not hard to figure out
with the age of our employees that there could be a couple
a year. If we could have a balance that may be enough just
to cover one or two employees a year. That is all I would
be prepared to even fund, because we would either have to
cut some other programs, or we would have to raise taxes and
we would have to go to the Public and try to explain that.
We are not going to do that.
Mr. Dorsey: Mr. Bonte's question now cannot be answered.
Resolution No. 5 just does the basic thing to establish the
account. You are discussing policy this Council has not yet
adopted, sometime we will have to adopt, but it is not involved
in Resolution No. 5.
Mr. Bonte: Okay there are two aspects. You are absolutely
right John. How are you going to administer this? All new
hires for example. Is it going to be a requirement that it
be identified to the Council that the cost of this employee
includes the necessary and required payout into this fund
so that when this person retires the money is there. This
Council needs to know that every time they hire a new employee,
what that cost is going to be. Secondly, my primary question
was and yes has not been answered, but I think you can answer
or at least we need to have language that when you create
this fund, what mechanics will be there in the event where
should the amounts at some point in time that are being properly
contributed to this fund, at some point it is looked at and
said these amounts that are now growing in this fund and the
interest that it is obtaining is far greater than what our
anticipated payout needs are going to be over the next 20
years, and the Township now passes an Ordinance to now take
x number of dollars out of that fund and use it for some other
purpose in Town. That is my question.
Mr. Dorsey: You know the answer to that question. You can
draw an Ordinance, where you can specifically dedicate money
for a specific purpose. We can do that when we get around
to forming the policy for this account. As you know, any subsequent
Council can always change any Ordinance so there is no point
in my trying to tell you that if I was thusly inclined, that
this can be locked up forever. It's like in the last
Administration, the Governor borrowed against the pension
fund and took away the surpluses that were there. It is not
supposed to happen. We put language in the Ordinance that
establishes the account but now you and I probably won't be
around 2020 when they raid that account.
Mr. Bonte: You have answered my question for me. What we
do need to do is obviously make sure that if we are going
to set this up that at some point it does become a working
fund where a new hire at least on a
Mr. Bonte (cont'd): budgetary matter that number is identified
to the Council. If somebody is going to cost $100,000 a year
for example and another $10,000 is needed to go into this
fund per year to provide for the necessary retirement fund
and or sick time payout to whatever, you guys need to know
that with every person you are hiring, and that that money
be put in there. Maybe one of the things you should consider
is and I agree with you Steve we can't make it up in the past,
but we can set a point in time where starting with every new
hire, it is done right. Thank you.
President Scapicchio: Thanks Rich. Anyone else from the Public
on the Consent Resolution Agenda? Seeing none we will close
the Public Portion.
ROLL CALL: Passed Unanimously.
Turkey Brook Park Bid Discussion
Resolution to Award Bids for Turkey Brook Park (Building
and/or Site Work).
Mr. Dorsey: In the first place the CFO was very upset that
we were going to adopt this Resolution because it is not in
her manual or procedure book that we proceed in this fashion
and you know Mr. President we are violating all the rules
of the Council in terms of bringing things on. This is where
we are. We received last Tuesday, two separate sets of bids,
both dealing with the development of Turkey Brook Park. The
first set of bids we'll address is what's known as the building
package and the low bidder immediately withdrew his bid because
he was fantastically low. The second bidder is clearly now
the low bid and his Number is 695,000 and it appears that
his bid is entirely in order. There were eight bidders for
the sight work. They would appear to be, as you look through
them, all very competitive bids in terms of the prices received.
Two low bidders under site work, the lowest bidder and the
base bid was that of Kyle Conte Contracting whose bid was
$3,777,773.00 and that of AIC whose base bid has somewhat
higher but not significantly higher. By the last meeting,
Mrs. Jenkins had detailed all of the monies that are available.
The only amount of money that is available at this very moment
is the money that is still in or has not otherwise been spent
or committed in the basic Turkey Park Ordinance. The amount
of that sum is $4,529,652.78. You can't award even the base
bid for both contracts unless you produce more money and add
that to the balance that is currently in that fund. There
are three other amounts that are available if the Township
Council wishes to move them. The first is that in the Turkey
Brook contribution account there is at the moment a sum of
$289,523.70. There is in an account which we refer to as the
AIG/Baker account at the moment $266, 666.00 which represents
the sums already received by the Township from the sale of
certain easements in connection with International Drive South.
Those monies according to Mr. Spino's original motion were
to be dedicated to tax reduction or tax relief, they can be
appropriated for this purpose. The third item that we assume
is available for purposes of this discussion is a $200,000.00
contribution from the soccer club and it is my understanding
that in that connection they are particular in seeing that
alternate No. 4 of the site bid is awarded which is the sand
based soccer field. We could make an award tonight, we can
make an award to Conte or the site work which will include
the base bid that obviously involves about $4,000,000.00 worth
of work, plus alternate No. 1 which I think is baseball field
No.7 and alternate No. 4 which is the sand based soccer field
and the award for the building package if we all agree that
we will appropriate from the three items I mentioned namely
the contributions already received, the AIG/Baker fund and
the $200,000 from the Soccer Club. We would have sufficient
money plus a 5.5 percent contingency fund which will have
to include some soft costs because the only thing we are discussing
in these bids are hard costs and there are bonding costs that
are involved with that bond ordinance. So it's like a 5 percent
contingency fund of $250,000.00. I see the leaders of the
Soccer Club here tonight and they immediately mentioned the
memorandum of agreement. I wrote a letter to the Township
Council a year and a half ago about that and I thought the
one thing that had to be included was a provision that either
the agreement terminates after a period of time or that there
is a provision by which the agreement would be terminated
because we had a Public Discussion of this at one point in
time and we all agreed that while everybody on the Council
at the moment and everybody at the Soccer Club may all be
able to get along, there obviously could come a time in which
there are different approaches to light, from my standpoint.
There has to be in that agreement either a provision for arbitration
if disputes arise or a provision for ultimate termination
of the agreement and of course I assume that the Soccer Clubs'
Memorandum of Agreement and the purpose of it deals only with
the soccer fields and not with the entire complex. That was
my recommendation to you sometime ago. That leaves it up to
you now as to what you want to do with that agreement. I assume
that the Soccer Club is not going to write the check. So we're
are going to make an award tonight and we can avoid the possibility
of changing the low base bidder to another base bid and still
award alternate for the sand based soccer field the alternate
one a baseball field and provide for a 5.5 percent contingency
and soft cost fund. It is a significant amount of money here.
It's like $280,000 above the hard costs with the understanding
that these bids would be awarded but they would also have
to be subject to the amendment to the Turkey Brook Development
Bond Ordinance which I understand Mrs. Jenkins has made arrangements
for next Tuesday's meeting, the introduction. It is subject
to your agreeing to use the other two accounts and the soccer
club coming forth with its $200,000.00, because the one thing
you cannot do is issue a contract award which is not made
subject to appropriate things because you must have available
the money inhand before the Resolution can become totally
operative. If you have any questions about that I will try
to answer them. The issue of how much of a contingency fund
you should have is capable of debate. The only thing I would
point out is there are additional monies coming but I would
emphasize they are not in hand for the contribution fund.
The $350,000 ultimately would come from Toll Brothers and
in terms of the AIG/Baker there is another payment due in
August of $133,333.00. Those monies of course are not included
and cannot be counted at the moment.
President Scapicchio: Rob, before we get started with the
Mayor Licitra: I have had discussion with the Chairman of
Turkey Brook Committee and Members of the Recreation Committee,
our Township professionals, the Soccer Club, yourself Dave,
as many people as I could. Even though I was not here last
week I digested what was said and tried to come to a decision
on where we should proceed. I would like to make a recommendation
along the lines of what John just said. I would like to award
the contract and the way we are awarding it minus the entrance
way of the field. It has always been from the beginning when
we started this project. For the Soccer Club it has always
been about the sand based fields. Even though we disagree
on it, and I'll disagree until it works. They have come to
the table, they want to see a sand based field. I hope it
works. I think it will, but it is technology that they have
seen work and I have not yet. So I wait to be pleasantly surprised.
I think the Soccer Club as well as the Baseball Club, as well
as all our clubs have been part of the process and have come
to the table and the other clubs in Town are raising money
for tax relief's so we could support Turkey Brook. I have
tried to please everybody. I think we have found a way to
get to the 5 percent reserve fund that the Council had said
last week that they had really wanted to be at. We are giving
the fields; the baseball, soccer and football fields to the
organizations in Town that they need desperately because of
our increasing population and especially our youth population.
So lets get started, we promised enough to the youth. We can
get the meetings going and get our professionals in touch
with those professionals and I guess in the greater American
words, lets roll. Lets get going on this. Lets get it done
President Scapicchio: Mayor, I thought you had another proposal
you told me about before this meeting in your office which
was to pull the building portion of this bid of $695.00 out
of here and you wanted to explore with the Council and Mr.
Dorsey possibly forcing the low bidder to stick with his bid.
Mayor Licitra: I have been involved in public projects for
thirty years. Sometimes you can't get as much money as you
wanted to get but you're stuck with it. It is your bid. I
understand where the Council is coming from and I understand
that we are looking at a bid of $250,000, while other people
are bidding $680,000, $670,000 for that work. I would like
to explore the possibility and we have some time to explore
that possibility not just rejecting that bid but discussing
that bid with the bidder. That's why I leave it in John's
hands because neither one of us could get involved in that
Mr. Dorsey: Look, I will absolutely guarantee you that the
low bidder bid $250,000 and the bid was no sooner open and
read and he stood up and said I made a mistake, and he explained
it exactly how he made a mistake. That his estimator failed
to double the number. I would bet $2,000, I would bet $5,000
that if were to try to award him the bid he would go to Court
and withdraw that bid and a court would just shake it's head
when the next low bid is $695,000 and it becomes unbelievable
that he did not make a mistake.
Mayor Licitra: If I may interject, the mistake was made that
he did multiply by a multiplier of two, that would still bring
us up to $500,000 for this project. $180,000.00 less. Even
that was accepted, even if there was negotiating accepted.
I am asking your opinion. What I am saying to you that even
at $500,000.00 with caveats on completion of work. We are
still saving $180,000.00.
Mr. Dorsey: Look, I don't want to say anything to interfere
with any possibility of saving the Township money. I do think
that if you want to pursue that route you are going to have
to reject all bids and re-bid the building package on the
assumption that he will correct his error and come in at $500,000.00.
Someone might not ask him whether he was really prepared to
do the job at $500,000 but I think if you want to pursue that
route, you do have sixty days from the date those bids were
received before you have to accept or reject. You can do that.
I could just change this Resolution that took the better part
of the day to draw and leave the award of the building package
out, if that is what you want to do. I don't have a problem
Mr. Greenbaum: John I just had a clarification on page three
of the Ordinances drafted specifically in the middle and in
the bottom Now Therefore paragraphs, you have included alternate
No. 2 which I assume
Mr. Dorsey: No. that's a typo, it should be No. 4.
President Scapicchio: In defense of Mr. Dorsey, I called
his office at 7:30 this morning and I told him that we needed
this Resolution up here tonight, so he was certainly put under
the gun in terms producing it. I think
what is on the table here has now generated some discussion
and we have some serious decisions to make here.
Mr. Rattner: Something this big, that we are working this
hard on. We were given last week at a meeting nothing in writing,
we just wrote it off. This is where we are going, this is
what the bids are and we are going with AIC. I actually spent
the weekend trying to investigate AIC. It is amazing I could
not find a listing, directory assistance didn't have a listing,
but that is something else, there may be a new company or
somebody came together. So this morning, the first thing I
did after I spent a weekend actually trying, I was actually
going to take a ride down there to see if I could find Green
St. I asked the Clerk's Office to get me a copy of their letterhead
or something to find out at least a phone number. I tried
every which way, I had AT & T check for the whole area
for any place in New Jersey for AIC and I could not find a
listing. So anyway just a few minutes later I get a call from
Dave saying we're going with somebody else. I was starting
to have concerns about that company, to get a Resolution presented
to us and then say we are going to vote on it on a project
this big with the experience we've had with big projects in
the past, I have a concern with. I know the concern that the
CFO has that we are basically being asked to accept a bid
when we don't have an availability of funds from the CFO,
which is absolutely required by statute.
Mr. Dorsey: Wait a minute. Almost every Resolution we ever
do says subject to the issuance of availability of funds.
So we generally don't have that.
Mr. Ratter: It does not usually say subject, it says that
the treasurer has provided us with it.
Mr. Dorsey: I have drawn thousands of Resolutions, I don't
know whether you have or not. It always says subject to the
issuance of that certificate.
Mr. Rattner: Do you want to put $2,000 up on that that you
said that every time? I am hearing a little better about not
going with one and bringing the costs down. That solves that
problem. One of the things I noticed in here, which you did
pick up is saying that some of the money and you actually
put it in the Resolution which was originally dedicated to
tax reduction. That was the sale of the property for AIG/
Baker so Walmart could be built, other wise it wouldn't go
down I was not originally for that to commit the dollars to
that way but I believe that was Mr. Scapicchio and Mr. Spino
that insisted on it that that would be the only way that we
would go forward. I got a problem now saying well, I know
we told the people this is exactly what we said we are going
to do with the money, but we came up with a better idea so
that is scrapped, something that we just heard, just very
recently, about the last 10 minutes, then I look at the bid
spreadsheet that I got last week. I actually have some questions
on the bids itself. I am happy the engineer reviewed it. According
to this, it says Conte did not bid on certain components.
Where we said there has to be a million square feet of top
soil that has to be spread, they bid nothing. I could not
find it anyplace else, I found a couple other things where
we told them how many pieces or what the units were.
Mr. Scapicchio: Steve, I have brought that discrepancy to
Mr. Buczynski's attention and Gene, I will let you share the
discussion that you and I had with the Council and the Public.
Mr. Buczynski: I will just address the fact that I want to
get the idea that they are not going to spread topsoil all
over the site because they bid zero in that. If you read the
bid they way it is set up by Stewarts, those are only approximate
quantities and prices. The determination of the cost to do
the entire work is based on a lump sum price. Furthermore,
I spoke to Mr. Conte today. We also have a letter I think
they sent for clarification a couple of days ago. He realizes
what he did there but it is included in his other costs. The
bottom line is for the lump sum price he is going to do everything
that is shown on the plans. You can bid zero for certain prices
and include it, spread it out somewhere else. Just so you
know, the way this bid was set up, the bid is being awarded
strictly as a lump sum bid. The unit price was put in there
for informational purposes and they utilize if later they
are going for some additional work.
Mr. Rattner: Every major contract I have had since I have
been here which is thirteen out of the last fifteen years,
we had change orders, contingencies or whatever where we had
to go up usually in the 20% range. If they have quantities
on here and they find out that something is wrong, how do
they do the change order? Your saying with the lump sum there
will be absolutely no change order because they know the job,
and regardless of the quantities that are needed.
Mr. Buczynski: They know the limit of work, it gets clearly
stated to them. The unit price is put in the bid for informational
purposes where the quantities I should say were estimated
quantities, not guaranteed quantities and they are given the
opportunity to consider their bid almost like a worksheet
based on those quantities for each item or they could add
their own quantities. That is why therearesome discrepancies
in the special comment column for the contractor to put what
he thought was his items. Basically, as a worksheet to come
up with a lump sum price. The lump sum price is clearly stated
elsewhere in the documents to do all the work as shown on
the plans within the limits as shown on the plans.
Mr. Rattner: As long as our quantities were fairly good,
so regardless of what he put down.
Mr. Buczynski: The quantities are to just give him some comfort
level of what's anticipated on the project.
Mr. Rattner: Suppose our quantities are off?
Mr. Buczynski: There is estimated quantities.
Mr. Rattner: Will there be a change order then?
Mr. Buczynski: Not unless there is an additional scope of
work. We have to do something that is not shown on the previous
Mr. Rattner: We told them that we must of given them a sanitary
sewer. We gave every bidder, saying this is the plan for the
sanitary sewer, you need 325 linear ft. of this side, 1500
ft. of this side. Every contractor did that and this bidder
came in and took the 2300 of linear ft. and cut it way down.
Mr. Dorsey: Those were Purcell specifications, not Buczynski's
Mr. Buczynski: I did not do the specs, but we reviewed them
Mr. Rattner: He is the person Purcell worked on with Olympus
I am sure.
Mr. Dorsey: I don't think so.
Mr. Buczynski: That was the unit prices that they bid. You
are looking at a specific other project. Most of those projects
are bid as unit quantities, where you pay them based on the
quantities. We are going to be paying them based on the percentage
of construction. Those quantities are to be utilized to determine
the percentage of payment.
Mr. Rattner: So this is strictly a lump sum do to the whole
Mr. Buczynski: Yes.
Mr. Rattner: Just like other lump sum contracts had which
we turned out to be cost plus.
President Scapicchio: Is there some kind of language that
you would like to see in a Resolution or a letter
Mr. Rattner: I have not had that much detail, I saw the Resolution
with what wants to be done at about 7:05 for a project this
big and you are asking me to make a decision this quickly.
We did it verbally last week. I Got here 7:00 tonight and
this is the first time I looked at it. I think that is unfair,
if I wanted to go over it. I am basically going to vote on
it, we may as well have a dictation. Just trust me. That is
what you are saying. Everything is fine. What am I doing up
here if I am not going to really review it?
President Scapicchio: Steve, we have a Resolution. This was
put on this agenda for discussion purposes. This Resolution
that I requested was in anticipation of a direction that I
thought this Council may decide to go in. We can decide tonight
to not move forward on this resolution. We could decide to
move forward in this resolution as is drafted, or we can decide
to move forward on a resolution that is different than what
is in front of us. We are here to discuss the bids.
Mr. Rattner: What I heard is that we wanted to move on this
President Scapicchio: The Mayor and I would like to move
forward on this project if we could come to a consensus among
the seven members of this board. If the other five members
believe that they do not have enough information or that this
resolution was put in front of their desk at the last minute,
they can all decide to put this off. You can decide how much
time you think you need. That is how this Resolution got on
the table tonight. The discussion that you and I, Steve, as
Council President when I talked to the Mayor, the Mayor's
concern was that last week when this was discussed, the Council,
specifically you Steve, had an issue with the amount of money
that was left on the table for contingencies. The Mayor's
recommendation was "you know what Dave, the fields are
what has been and are the most important part of this project.
If Steve's concern is the amount of contingency that we leave
on the table, I would recommend that we take out the front
entrance way image and move forward with the construction
of the fields." He said that will satisfy Steve's concern
of leaving additional monies on the table and it lets us move
forward with the construction of the fields. Mayor is that
Mayor Licitra: You said it better than I would. I would not
of said it that way.
Mr. Rattner: I don't have a doubt that is one of the things
that I wanted. Just looking at everything in total. We discussed
it. There was nothing in front of us. Nothing to look at.
We know some of the issues that we have had and some of the
false starts that we had. That is why we had to go out to
bid a second time. It is a very complicated project.
President Scapicchio: That is why we are here discussing
Mr. Dorsey: I want to make it one point Steve. The award
to Conte is driven by the numbers bid and nothing else. The
numbers bid include No. 4 in order to get the $200,000 from
the soccer, so the award is driven by the numbers, nothing
Mr. Rattner: I understand that. I know Conte as a contractor,
they have been in the area and the State for a long time.
I don't have a problem with the contractors. It just understanding.
If you ask me to vote affirmatively, I like to understand
the numbers I am looking at. That's all I want. The Resolution
has been driven by the dollar numbers and by the soccer clubs
Mr. Dorsey: I take no position in that. I just want to make
the record clear that the resolution has been driven by the
dollar numbers and by the Soccer Clubs contribution.
Mr. Rattner: I don't have any problem with the contract,
I don't have any problem with the phases, I don't have a problem
with the way we are moving. The only issue I have is that
I have not had time to look at all the documentation and make
sure that to me all the numbers add up and make sense.
Mrs. Miller: I did not receive a copy of the resolution.
Mrs. Lashway: It was not in your packet that was placed in
front of you.
Mrs. Miller: I must have misplaced it, so I could not vote
on it tonight. I prefer to wait until the next meeting.
Mr. Spino: I was prepared to vote and support the Mayor on
this. Since questions have been asked, at least one Council
person does not have the information. I would move we table
it. If we have to, at our next meeting and it is probably
a workshop. If we want we could make that a Public Meeting
to make a decision on this issue if everyone has the information
they need in the meantime we could also have a meeting to
Mr. Dorsey: Mr. Spino is absolutely correct, if you think
you are ready by next Tuesday than you can cause it tobe a
Public Meeting as well.
Mr. Guenther: Steve, what specifically do you want? Do you
want time to discuss this or study it?
Mr. Rattner: I want time to look at it. I see a lot of numbers
on here, I see some things on here I don't understand, that's
all. It may be perfectly acceptable. The contractor does not
bother me. The options make sense. I have to make decisions
on what we have told the Public before. Once we get everything
in place, it is just knowing exactly what I am voting on.
We just said there is three or four typos in the resolution
itself, obviously the thing was done very quickly. So obviously
everything was done very quickly. Is there anything maybe
in the numbers too. Then we are committed to it. We have been
caught too many times.
Mr. Spino: I would assume a motion to table takes preference
over any other discussion.
Mr. Spino made a motion to table this Awarding of Bids to
Turkey Brook Park Resolution and Mrs. Miller seconded that
ROLL CALL: Passed Unanimously with the exception of Mr. Greenbaum
and Mr. Scapicchio who voted no.
Mayor Licitra: Let me say something. I think this Council
and this Mayor have gotten along famously and we have come
to bring this Township a long way. Let me tell you, we tabled
this last week, we tabled it this week. I am going to tell
you something, I hope you come prepared to vote yes or no
on this next week. I hope you come prepared, and don't find
another excuse not to do it. We have given you a contract,
and we have given you within the means of this Township. I
hope you just come here to vote next week. Thank you.
Mr. Guenther: I think a there is a bit of an exception to
that. If there are some doubts and it was not the proper detail
that was provided last week, I think it was incumbent of somebody
to make sure that these sheets were provided and we had a
week to study this to be able to take a vote tonight. I have
no problem with voting tonight, apparently some members do.
They did not have the proper information. Somebody failed
to get that information to them.
Mr. Greenbaum: I had one question before we got on the motion
to table, what do we lose by putting this back a week or two,
the decision, if anything?
Mr. Buczynski: That was the schedule to hopefully get them
into construction I think by March 3, 2002. That was the original
schedule to keep everything going towards getting the fields
ready when they wanted them ready.
Mr. Dorsey: In fairness to Mr. Greenbaum, we really don't
lose a whole lot tonight because it was going to be subject
to getting the Soccer Club's $200,000, subject to Mrs. Jenkins
issuing the certificate of availability of funds, and the
amendment to the bond ordinance. Mrs. Jenkins where is that
Mrs. Jenkins: Well obviously I could not have it prepared
yet because I did not know what the final decision was going
to be. My question is are we ready to move forward?
Mr. Dorsey: I don't want to hear that next week. I think
you should get that Ordinance. It is not changing the bonding
amount, it is only changing the amount to be expended.
Mrs. Jenkins: Clearly you were aware that there wasn't a
consensus as to whether we were going to utilize all those
funds or need to until before.
Mr. Dorsey: Mrs. Jenkins, Mrs. Jenkins, I love you, but listen
to me. I don't want to go through that argument next week.
You want to make that bond ordinance. You want to increase
the expenditure to the amount of
President Scapicchio: We don't know what the amount is yet,
Mr. Dorsey: I know what the amount is.
President Scapicchio: Lets make sure. I know you do.
Mr. Dorsey: She knows what the amount is.
President Scapicchio: Could I get a consensus from the Council
members that we understand some of them want to look at this
a little longer. Do we think we have a consensus to move forward
with the base bid in the options as were outlined in this
Council unanimously agreed with the exception of Mr. Guenther
who wishes to discuss this further.
Mr. Guenther: I am confused with some of the information
here quite frankly.
President Scapicchio: If you are confused then ask the questions.
We have the people here tonight to answer these questions.
Mr. Guenther: That's the other thing I would like to get
on the table. Steve had some doubts. He's saying now he is
ready to move ahead with it. I am confused where Steve is
Mr. Rattner: I said I think I could move ahead. The concept;
I like the options. I just want to understand exactly what
I am voting on. I don't understand all the numbers. I don't
understand. I just got the stuff tonight. It does not make
much of a difference. Everybody could say what they want to,
but when it is subject to, everything has to be done first
before you can go and tell the contractor you have to go.
It would not be done for another couple of weeks. I am just
saying do it right. Don't ask me to vote for something before
I have a chance to read it. That is just ludicrous. No body
should do that. That's all it is. We are not losing anything.
I am saying the options are good. We take out the building
at this point because we don't
know what we are doing with it. We don't even have a funding
problem. We are talking about a couple hundred thousand dollars
that we're short. We are taking out $600,000. We can go gangbusters
with the other part with what we already have just moving
President Scapicchio: I am not sure that there was consensus
to take the building out.
Mr. Guenther: That is what I am confused about.
Mr. Rattner: I thought it was if we were voting tonight.
I thought the Mayor was going to go back and talk to them.
President Scapicchio: Here is what happened. The Mayor had
made a suggestion that maybe that's what we should do. Mr.
Dorsey's recommendation was if that is the consensus of the
governing body, we need to reject all bids and put it out
for a complete rebid.
Mr. Dorsey: All building package bids.
President Scapicchio: I, for one, am not ready to reject
Mr. Rattner: We don't have to reject them, we just don't
have to take action on the building this week or next week.
We have sixty days from when the bids came in. We can get
ready with everything else, and the building is something
else. A week or two or three weeks of awarding that bid is
not going to make a real big difference especially when the
other guy is not going to get started anyway.
Mr. Greenbaum: Question for Mr. Dorsey. If you reject the
building bids, does it in anyway impact the other bid?
Mr. Dorsey: No. There were two separate bid packages.
Mr. Greenbaum: Even with respect to the matter in which it
is being funded.
Mr. Dorsey: It would decrease the amount that you absolutely
have immediately available to you, but that's all.
President Scapicchio: In terms of progression of work Gene,
does it make a difference?
Mr. Buczynski: We could move with the site work first. I
think you also have the question of whether or not you want
to rebid that building or not.
President Scapicchio: I for, one, am not prepared to rebid
that unless somebody gives me a good reason to reject.
Mr. Buczynski: There is no guarantee when you rebid that
little guy is going to bid. I would put my money on it that
he is not going to bid it. He's gone from Mt. Olive as far
as I am concerned.
President Scapicchio: Would it satisfy the Council members
if we were to have Mr. Dorsey draw two separate resolutions?
Mr. Guenther: Yes.
President Scapicchio: One for the building and one for the
actual field construction. I for one am in favor of one resolution
that addresses all of them.
Mr. Greenbaum: I don't think it makes a difference.
President Scapicchio: It makes a difference if terms of if
we can't get five affirmative votes to move forward on this
because the building portion of that is in this resolution,
then I would like to see the resolution split.
Mr. Greenbaum: I think it should be one resolution for several
reasons. First, I agree with Mr. Dorsey, that bid was obviously
a mistake. There is no way you could hold the bidder to that
number. Also, I am not sure I want to go with someone who
makes a mistake of that drastic in nature in their bid even
if they came back and said that they could do it at a cheaper
number because as far as I am concerned you are starting from
behind the eight ball.
Mr. Dorsey: The key question now is whether or not you all
will be satisfied with a 5.5% contingency that is going to
include some soft costs. Some fees in there for Gene, some
for myself, some for bond council, which is a number about
$280,000. In other words, if you take what is leftover, and
you add to it the contributions, the Soccer Club and the AIG
money it brings you to $5,285,000. If you award the building
package, the site plan package with the two alternates you've
got to do, you're at $5,005,000, which a difference of $285,000.
My question is whether that is enough to make everybody happy.
Mr. Guenther: I was sort of under the impression it was going
to be a higher contingency.
President Scapicchio: You have two ways you could get more
money on the table Bernie. You could either borrow more or
you can eliminate one of the optional add ons.
Mr. Rattner: With the contingency, two things. First, you
have the $260,000 which we told the Public that was going
to be for tax reduction and now we are going to say we changed
our mind. I think I am willing to go with that. The contingency
seems light. But we have other money that is going to be coming
in. We don't need it at this point. However we know the likelihood
of receiving at least a portion of that both from Toll Brothers,
we also have another payment from AIG. In fact that is contractual.
So we could use that and that could be amended later. So if
we look at that we actually have more money for a contingency.
That part I think I could be satisfied with, if everything
else fits because we know we are getting it.
President Scapicchio: So, Steve you barring any additional
information that changes your mind as of right now, you would
be satisfied with one single resolution that addresses the
building and the construction of the fields and leaves the
$260,000 contingency on the table.
Mr. Rattner: I think we are better off with it to because
if there are any other questions we have to investigate and
I don't know if I want to go in and rebid on the building.
It just makes more sense. I don't think there is any problem
here that we are going to move ahead with the fields to get
that moving. If there is any question at all, let it be with
the building and lets delay it a couple of weeks. It is not
going to make a real big difference. This way we could get
moving. The dirt can start being moved, the infrastructure
gets put in and we are actually getting somewhere. The big
determining factor is when they are completed with the fields,
giving that time to grow so we know when we are going to use
President Scapicchio: Let me get a consensus, here John.
Consensus for two resolutions is Unanimous with the exception
of Mr. Greenbaum who agreed to one resolution.
Mr. Dorsey: I think one thing we agree on Steve whether we
do one or two Resolutions, we should authorize the full amount
we can achieve by adding in the AIG/Baker, the Soccer Club
and the Turkey Brook contributions. Mrs. Jenkins is going
to throw cold water on me.
Mrs. Jenkins: Do we have consensus for me to go to bond council
now and amend the bond ordinance up to the maximum which is
Mr. Dorsey: Understand what we are amending. We are not amending
the amount that is to be bonded. We are simply amending the
amount to be expended which I could do in five minutes, but
will take 5 days for bond Council. Steve do we agree? Add
them all up.
President Scapicchio: Mr. Dorsey, do we need a resolution
to make next weeks meeting a Public Meeting?
Mr. Dorsey: Be it Resolved by the Township Council Township
of Mt. Olive the eve that the meeting is scheduled for March
5, 2002 will be a Special Public Meeting commencing at 7:30
with a workshop to follow there after. The purpose of this
special meeting will be to adopt a resolution or resolutions
awarding contracts in connection with the development of Turkey
Brook Park and the introduction of the amendment to bond ordinance
No. 36-00 originally adopted to provide for an increase in
the total amount of authorized expenditures in that ordinance.
Mr. Rattner moved for approval of this Special Public Meeting
and Mr. Spino seconded that motion.
President Scapicchio: Any Council Discussion on that Resolution?
ROLL CALL: Passed Unanimously
Mr. Guenther: Is it going to be necessary for us to meet
before next Tuesday, Steve, to make sure you are satisfied
with the information that you need.
Mr. Rattner: I am going to talk with the Administration to
make sure that I have everything and I am satisfied.
President Scapicchio: I would make the suggestion that everybody
look at the Resolution, the contracts that are being proposed.
Any questions, bring them to Mr. Dorsey, Mr. Buczynski or
the Mayor's attention so we can hopefully get the appropriate
answers to satisfy those concerns prior to next weeks meeting.
Mayor, anything words to put this discussion to bed?
Mayor Licitra: Put it to bed.
1. Bill List
Mr. Guenther moved for approval of the Bill list and Mrs.
Miller seconded that motion.
ROLL CALL: Passed Unanimously.
2. Approval of Bingo Application #1022 for the Senior Citizens
of Mount Olive Township, also Raffle Application #1023 for
the Budd Lake First Aid & Rescue Squad.
Mr. Rattner moved for approval of Bingo Application #1022
and Raffle Application #1023 and Mr. Spino seconded that motion.
ROLL CALL: Passed Unanimously.
Library Board Liaison Report - none
Recreation Report - none
Board of Health, Mr. Perkins: We met the first Thursday of
the month. We reintroduced and revised the food handling ordinance
that deals with some of the fees that were charged. There
were some inconsistencies that were in there, some co-dates
that just had to be updated, it was non-monumental.
Planning Board, Mr. Greenbaum: Several issues. We met February
21st , and considered two development matters. The first was
Novaky, minor sub-division, basically just needs to conform
his plans to the professionals' comments, there was nothing
exceptional about the application. We also heard Commerce
Bank preliminary and final site plan. That is the proposed
application on Route 46 and Sandshore, that triangular piece
of property. He needs variances with regard to frontage setbacks
because his property is on both Sandshore and Route 46. The
major issue which was discussed with regard to the Commerce
Bank application was left turns off of Route 46 into the bank
which almost seemed to be unanimous that everyone was very
concerned about traffic being able to make left turns from
Eastbound 46 into the bank. That is an issue which is going
to be addressed at the next meeting with regard to that application.
A couple other matters were discussed. John Mania was appointed
as liaison from Planning Board to the Open Space Committee,
and there was one other issue which was discussed at length
and it dealt with Mr. Perkoski, and his concern over a project
which was approved probably over a year or two ago relating
to a fence that was drawn on the plans to demarcate his property
from an adjoining property. The fence was ultimately built,
Charlene I think you were on Planning Board at the time because
your name came up during the discussion. There was some discussion
during the Planning Board Application with regard to whether
or not foliage would be appropriate instead of a fence. Ultimately
it was approved by way of a resolution which did not call
for specifics with regard to the fence at least in terms of
it's height. I have not seen the resolution. Now there appears
to be two issues Mr. Perkoski is raising. One is with regard
to the height of the fence. The plans show a six foot fence
and the fence is four feet high. The other relates to the
length of the fence. Instead of 400 foot. running the length
of the property, the fence is only about 200 foot. The Planning
Board did not know how to handle the issue and punted to Council.
There was some suggestion that it was a Municipal Court issue
but I am not sure how one would go about enforcing that issue
in Municipal Court and I am not sure what power we have with
regard to a Planning Board Application which was approved,
the CO was issued and the Resolution does not talk about the
specifics of the design plan that were submitted.
President Scapicchio: John, how does one deal with a situation
like this where there is representations made on drawings
that were submitted and approved and the as built is not what
Mr. Dorsey: Well, from that in depth, detailed description
of the situation I do think it would be a matter for the Zoning
Officer filing a complaint in the Court that he has not complied
or the applicant or the owner has not complied with the requirements
that were granted. Certainly, the Township Council does not
have the ability to go back and amend any resolution that
was adopted by the Planning Board.
President Scapicchio: So John, do we have to instruct the
Administration to have the Zoning Officer go out there?
Mr. Dorsey: Yes. Fine.
Mr. Greenbaum: I think that the Zoning Officer actually has
to speak to Chuck first to get Chuck's take on everything
that was done because Chuck approved the property as the fence
was built. Chuck has a take that should be discussed before
the Zoning officer goes out. Then I think the Zoning Officer
should speak to Mr. Perkoski so that he has Mr. Perkoski's
point of view and that seems to be the appropriate way to
President Scapicchio: Sherry, once you determine the situation
if you can just advise the Council. Thanks.
Open Space Committee, Charlene Miller: Last week I think
I brought up about the holmqviest property, the situation
with the EDU's so that the State could eliminate them I guess
for the State in order to purchase them. There is something
in our packet about that from the Open Space Committee I believe.
Are we going to be able to put that on the Agenda and discuss
it for next week?
Mrs. Lashway: March 5, 2002 workshop.
Mrs. Miller: Okay, that's all.
Legislative Committee Report, Bernie Guenther: None
Master Plan Report, President Scapicchio: We had a meeting
two - three weeks ago. We have a final draft being prepared
now. We have one final meeting tentatively scheduled for March
14, 2002 at which time we will probably have a document that
we will send up to the Planning Board for review and then
that process begins.
Pride Committee Report, Ray Perkins: We had a meeting last
Tuesday. We formally got through our officer's elections.
Liz Ouimet is now the Chair. Suzanne Dimonda took over Vice
Chair, and Sandra Masklee volunteered for secretary. Three
items that we discussed that needed to be talked about now
would be our Memorial Day essay contest. That will be restricted
to the middle school this year. We only got two participants
from the high school last year. We don't seem to get a lot
of people from the high school. The answer is that they are
very busy with college paperwork and they don't have time.
However we do get a great turnout from the middle school so
we are going to keep it there. The billboard at the Clover
Hill Treatment Plant, it looks like it has been through the
war. We have already contacted the outdoor systems. We are
working on getting that one taking down because it is ripped
up and really sacreligious. We are working on a new billboard
with some sort of a Spring theme on it. That will be in the
upcoming, and the new welcome signs, I am anticipating picking
up actually a color painting of what the welcome signs will
look like within the next two or three weeks. Hopefully the
Pride Committee can bring that in and the Council can take
a look at that.
President Scapicchio: That brings us to the Public Portion
of the meeting. Anyone from the Public?
Colleen Labow, Budd Lake, NJ: First I would like to congratulate
my very good friend Elisa Muller for her appointment to the
Open Space Committee. I know she is very excited about it.
I also wanted to speak to Mr. Spino, I called M.A.P.S. about
having transportation for disabled persons within our Town.
Apparently it is available, it is at no cost, but I am playing
phone tag. I am not in a position to represent the Town, I
was just inquiring if it is available. I do have the supervisor's
phone number, but I left it at home, so I will get that that
to you and make the contacts.
Mr. Spino: We discussed that at our last ADA committee meeting.
It is available to take people to medical appointments and
things like that, not just to take them shopping or something
Mrs. Labow: The question I asked them was if you had a disabled
or handicapped or challenged person within Town, specifically
I gave the for instance a couple of people I have come in
contact with where they
had to get twenty a year-old to another Town for a job and
said that was available. So that was my specific question.
Mr. Spino: The question is availability to take them to that
job every day or just for that job appointment. We were under
the impression that from the information I had that they would
not take them to that job every day.
Mrs. Labow: One woman told me yes, that was available.
Mr. Spino: If you give me your name I will be glad to contact
Mrs. Labow: The other thing I wanted to say which I already
said to Mayor Licitra is that I was very sorry to hear about
your father's death.
Mayor Licitra: Thank you Colleen. He lived a great life.
Mrs. Labow: I am sure he did. Ninety is great, may we all
live that long. I also need to ask Mr. Dorsey, I just was
confused. Before you were very specific in saying that you
wanted to make it clear that the only thing that was driving
the award bids was the figures only and I was confused as
to why you were stressing that much. Has there been any motivation
towards bids in the past?
Mr. Dorsey: I don't believe so but I wanted to make it clear
that what drove the bid award were the denounced bid in relationship
to the Soccer Club and alternate No. 7.
President Scapicchio: Anyone else from the Public?
Christine Priest, Budd Lake, NJ: I need to express my displeasure
with the Council. This once more was tabled. The Turkey Brook
stuff. For those of you who know me. I lived in town for almost
24 years, and it was promised 24 years ago. It's been a hell
of a long time. It is just very disappointing that every time
"lets rebid it." It costs us another $500,000, "oh
lets bid it again" oh there we go another three quarters
of a $1,000,000.00. Every time we rebid it, it's a problem.
Let's get off the dime here guys. This is absolutely ridiculous
to have this tabled again. Mr. Rattner I have to tell you.
I have also known you for some time I appreciate that you
said well I did not get a chance to read this. I got here
and I did not get a chance to read it. It took me 10 minutes,
15 minutes and I shared it with a few people. I think it would
have been the most responsible thing for everyone who did
not get a chance to read this to ask for a 10 or 15 minute
recess. This is that important to this Town. It is that important
to these kids. I am involved in a lot of sports. I know a
lot of people. It is really important. Tuesday this better
happen. It has to happen for our Township.
Mr. Rattner: Are you saying a project this big, and when
we have had this experience in the past; that ten minutes
when there is other backup, there is probably documentation,
that much that we have not seen.
Mrs. Priest: That is not what you said.
Mr. Rattner: That is exactly what I said. I said I have some
of the bid worksheets, I don't understand it, I don't understand
the financing. We don't make the statutory requirements. I
have questions to ask. That is exactly what I said.
Mrs. Priest: Well it took me 10 minutes to read and understand
this, and I am not used to reading this kind of material.
It seems to me that all the paperwork has been around a long
time. I think everyone has had enough time to go through it.
I will certainly be back on Tuesday.
Mr. Scapicchio: Anyone else?
Bob Thomas, Budd Lake, NJ: This is the last time I will cover
the Council in terms of a reportage function and I just wanted
to say thank you for all the entertainment. It has been wonderful
to get to know every one of you. I may be back next week,
it all depends on how transportation works out in the city.
I did want to speak though, however, as one final opportunity
on proposed Ordinance No. 8-2002, which is the extension of
the Cable Vision Franchise for 10 years. The technology for
one thing is just expanding exponentially. You have no idea
what possibilities might be out there in five years that might
be ruled out by this type of franchise agreement. Secondly,
Cable Vision in particular, especially on Long Island has
been a very difficult cable provider to control with regards
to the interest of local viewers. Out there, folks have been
deprived of the ability to watch New York Mets games regardless
of the fee because it disputes between this cable company,
Cable Vision and so on an so forth. I think when you get to
the point when you give a cable franchisee a ten year license,
you lose the opportunity to speak on behalf of the citizens
who may or may not become upset with that franchise somewhere
along the line. This company has raised its rates for its
basic cable package. Something like 40 % - 50 % in the last
five or six years. It is the kind of thing that I know you
have had experiences with where folks come and say, what can
we do about this. It has not been brought up with Council
vocally for a little bit of time now, but I would not rule
that out as a possible next complaint of citizens a month
from now. By giving them a 10 year license you are just throwing
away the ability to have any leverage at all. The other part
of the purposed Ordinance that I question is the provision
of the entire cable channel to the Township. I may be wrong.
I read that as being to the Township Government or Township
Administration or the Municipality as it exists in that sense.
I would see nothing wrong with having a cable access that
would allow a private citizen who is a resident of Mount Olive
to come on a first come first serve basis and provide their
own programming on that channel. I think it kind of goes against
the grain at least as far as I am concerned to allow someone
in a Government position to determine what goes on a media
outlet. I think that is a very dangerous thing to do. Even
a city as large as New York City, has sold it's TV, It's am/fm
to a non-profit group and has gotten out of the business of
doing that. I don't think in this sense that we should get
into the business of doing that. If it is just a first come
first serve basis open to any resident of Mt. Olive that is
fine, but I don't think the Governing Body or the Administration
or any other functionary of the Township should be involved
in making those kind of decisions. Again, I thank you for
President Scapicchio: Thanks. We are going to miss you. You
have actually covered for the Mt. Olive Chronicle in what
we think is a very responsible way and it is something I don't
think we have been used to in a while. I just hope that the
owners of that paper replace you with somebody as competent.
Toni Ayres, Budd Lake, NJ: I, too, Paul would like to extend
my condolences to you on the death of your father. My father
also lived to be ninety. It was nice.
Mayor Licitra: My daughter gave us our first grandchild last
Saturday, that's how life goes - full tilt.
Ms. Ayres: Okay, I just have some comments I really don't
expect any answers, but I have to get them out. It was my
understanding from day one that Turkey Brook was going to
be a Community Park, and now it seems as though it is a Soccer
Park. Everything is being done on such a large scale, I lost
faith in Turkey Brook when I saw those three or four acres
of trees come down. A beautiful piece of property has been
ruined as far as my opinion, forever. The trees can't be replaced
with soccer fields. That is just my little bias. Next the
presentation by St. Claires. This almost smacks of a duplication
of services if that whatever it is, kiddie safety park. The
number one question that hit my mind, where are the parents?
Didn't we always use to teach safety to our children? Now
we need a special agency type thing to teach safety to our
children. They learn some aspects of safety in our school.
The Fire Department, the Police Department they all come in.
I am suspect that somewhere along the line St. Claires might
be benefiting financially from that. She did not give enough
information tonight for that. Also, they identified Budd Lake
as a problem area, but yet they are very interested in a piece
of property in Flanders. I understand about the swap. We could
make the land swap. Make up your mind. Then the teen center.
Again, I say it is a duplication of services. Do we really
need a teen center? Our schools are underutilized. I don't
get it. It is all our tax money. It seems to me with all are
cooperation and food for thought, maybe we could work out
something with the Board of Education. I don't know. I don't
have the answer. It is food for thought. I really think we
are moving to fast. Steve, I am glad you want time to think
about all those things concerning Turkey Brook. You renewed
Mr. Rattner: I wholeheartedly approve of Turkey Brook. I
do like, to a point, what they are doing. I just wanted to
understand it. It has nothing to do with where they are going
with it. I can understand the frustration of some people because
it has been so long and coming and they are right.
Mrs. Ayres: Initially, I understood it to be a community
Mr. Rattner: It still is.
Mrs. Ayres: I am going to play soccer? Give me a break.
Mr. Rattner: We are going to have the walking trails, etc.
Mrs. Ayres: Oh yeah. I'll be 6 feet under by the time that
gets done. Those are my comments for the evening. Thank you.
President Scapicchio: Thanks Toni. Any one else from the
Rich Bonte, Budd Lake, NJ: I have a number of items. First
of all for those of you who suggested that we delay the action
on Turkey Brook Park, I want to commend you. We don't make
a $4, $5 or $6 million award on any contract if they are having
the bids in for a week or two, without doing a thorough analysis
on what we are going to be bidding. A couple of questions,
I think you really need to look at something that Steve brought
up; that is, this issue of unit pricing. If this is a lump
sum bid, why did we ask for unit pricing? Should of asked
for it, shouldn't have provided that detail. Should have said
here is what we want done. Bid it. I believe that the fact
that you have unit pricing and that you provide unit quantity
information is an indication that this contract is intimately
going to be settled in Court at some time in the future, based
upon those unit quantities and the unit prices that were bid.
Be very careful here. When somebody comes in and says, we
are going to do this for a very low price something else you
know could probably escalate like more rock or whatever. This
Town is going to hold the bag. So it better be very clear
in the award that there would be no recourse on the fact that
the unit quantities may or may not be an error. These people
maybe better rethink their bids and realize that they are
committing to "a fixed price" otherwise we are going
to be in the same situation that we were with Purcell. Regarding
the companies which Steve said he could not find? Do we have
any kind of history of the companies that have bid this or
the winning bidders, and the work they performed? Do we know
what kind of work they do and can we get recommendations?
President Scapicchio: I had this discussion with Mr. Buczynski.
All of the bidders that participate are all qualified under
the rules and regulations of New Jersey Law to bid on this.
Mr. Bonte: Okay. I can't say anything else then on that.
There may be a typo or something missing on page two, because
it says from an account referred to as the account, in the
amount of $266,000. Should that say AIG or something else?
I think there is something missing there. Do we need a resolution,
or does this accomplish the change of intent of the original
$266,000 to be used for tax relief? I have no other comments
on Turkey Brook, other than be careful. On the Cable Vision
Ordinance, who wrote this?
Mr. Dorsey: This was submitted in part by the Cable Company
and the ten year apparently was their pound of flesh for giving
us an access channel.
Mr. Bonte: When I read this it looks like Cable Visions Attorney's
wrote this. This is a one sided agreement. For example, besides
the fact that I agree with Mr. Thomas regarding this Community
Access Channel and who is going to control it because I do
not believe that the government should be controlling, it
should be involved in communicating information other than
in an emergency nature to the Public. The other question I
have is the way things are written in here; "in the event
that another multi-channel video program provides service
within the Township creates a significant competitive disadvantage
to cable vision and they be compensated etc. This needs to
go in the garbage. No further comment on Cable Vision. The
Ordinance regarding the Land Use modifications. I understand
what's behind this. I think it is a good idea. One of my questions
was, when it talks about how you do the qualification map.
I don't see any restriction here when a qualifying map is
generated, as to whether there could be variances submitted
and that qualifying map. For example; could a developer come
in for qualifying a development under the conventional build
out. He might need thirty five variances to get certain lots.
Could he submit that to the Planning Board?
Mr. Dorsey: If that were done, he would not be consistent
with the term qualifying map but, we could send that ordinance
back to McGroarty and ask him to define the term qualifying
map in such way that it does not include variances. Mr. Greenbaum,
can you do that?
Mr. Greenbaum: I'd be happy to Mr. Dorsey.
Mr. Bonte: The last issue I have regards the surplus. The
budget surplus that we are not going to return to the Taxpayers
as been reported in the paper but instead would be held so
that we could have a modest tax increase this year and a modest
tax increase next year as opposed to utilizing that surplus
for a tax reduction this year. Is there a surplus? Can anybody
answer that question?
Mrs. Jenkins: Yes we have a surplus. The year end surplus
Mr. Bonte: Thank you. Where did that come from?
Mrs. Jenkins: It came from prior year budgets that weren't
expended, it came from excess revenues that we realized over
what we anticipated we were going to realize.
Mr. Bonte: Where did we realize those revenues from?
Mrs. Jenkins: The majority of the excess revenues were realized
in construction fees.
Mr. Bonte: Do we also obtain a significant amount of revenues
as a result of monies collected as quote school tax after
the school budget is officially passed and the rate is passed
by law and then new houses come on line after that point in
time for the next year?
Mrs. Jenkins: You are speaking about added assessments?
Mr. Bonte: Yes. About how much is that a year?
Mrs. Jenkins: We have had a $1,000,000.00 of added assessments.
Mr. Bonte: So basically what you are saying is about a $1,000,000.00
of monies were collected under the guise the guys of the school
tax but now have really ended up in the Municipal Coiffeurs.
Mrs. Jenkins: The added assessments get split between the
Municipality and the County. The school gets no portion of
Mr. Bonte: So we essentially get sort of a windfall as a
result of that even though it is collected under "the
guige of the school tax"?
Mrs. Jenkins: For added assessment purposes, yes. Certainly
when it goes on the ratable base in the next year the school
gets the benefit of it.
Mr. Bonte: Here is the point I want to make to this Council.
There was in a letter in a newspaper by the Mayor that one
of the goals here should be, "if we use the surplus to
lower taxes this year we will have a large tax increase next
year. If we don't use the surplus to lower tax this year we
could have a modest tax increase this year and a modest tax
increase next year."
Mayor Licitra: I did not write that. I did not mention next
Mr. Bonte: My point is this. These are monies that have been
collected from all of us as taxpayers in prior years that
have not been needed to operate Municipal Government. They
are rightfully the public's money, not the Council's money.
That money should not be manipulated in a fashion to affect
the tax rate. I think we need to identify what the potential
emergency expenses come out to be during the current year
and I think we could do that and make a determination as to
what is a reasonable surplus to carry forward and return the
balance of the money to the taxpayer. I did not agree to make
an interest free loan to this Town for two years or longer.
I don't think everybody else in this Town gave their hard
earned tax dollars to the Town for the benefit of an interest
free loan for whatever purpose. If the money is not required
in the 2002 budget the tax rate should be set to bring the
surplus down to a level that is appropriate. I don't believe
$3,000,000.00 is appropriate. The Town budget is somewhere
in the neighborhood of $18,000,000 - $20,000,000. Is that
correct. A little less. So we are talking about a surplus
that could be 20% or greater. I don't think that's fair to
the working public. Those monies should be returned to us.
If next year's tax rate has to be bigger, fine. Make it what
it has to be next year, but don't borrow this money from all
of us now and tell us it would be good to have a lower tax
rate this year and next year. Set the budget appropriately,
determine what you feel is a comfortable contingency fund
for this year, reduce the tax rate to what it needs to be
to work that surplus down to what the appropriate surplus
level should be at the end of 2002. Thank you.
Mayor Licitra: I am just going to say, you prudently plan.
You don't have surprises on people and you don't rob Peter
to pay Paul and as far as I am concerned that is what you
are going to do. I cannot keep on telling you how many non
recurring charges you are going to have in your Budgets. You
don't know yet what you are going to see next year as far
tax relief and people coming back on tax appeals, so I agree
with the way Sherry is handling this situation right now.
If you want something next year that is going to spike up
and not be responsible that's your decision. You have the
Mr. Rattner: Mayor, stop while you're behind. Actually, your
budget did reflect what Mr. Bonte is asking for. When you
talk about the added assessments we do get that but we also
have to cover for the uncollected taxes. We put in our budget
about two or three percent so we have to keep the School Board
whole. We ended the year with about $3,000,000.00 in surplus.
The budget that the Mayor presented us brings that back down,
uses all but about $700,000.00. That's what he's asking. The
State guidelines are somewhere in the four to seven percent,
they have something in there. I know we've have always talked
about what is the appropriate level in the past, but we use
it. They know because when they look at the added assessments
and other things, they look at the replenishing going in the
next year, but the majority part of the surplus is being used.
In fact in past years sometimes with me saying that we were
going down to low, because it has to cover cash flow if the
economy is bad and people pay their taxes slowly, we still
have to keep the School Board whole. We have to keep the County
whole on a timely bases. We do use it in their calculation.
They are calculating what they are trying to replenish and
they have to sell it to us, what the proper level is. But
they are using a good portion of that surplus, and they do
each year. Did I say something wrong Mrs. Jenkins? Were those
numbers pretty close?
Mrs. Jenkins: I think we left a little bit more in surplus.
Mr. Rattner: Okay, well that number does pretty much go back
and forth. We did do the majority of it. We don't keep it
there. I think this Council and I think this Administration
realizes it is the taxpayer's money and there is no sense
just keeping it. We keep what we think is a prudent level
and that is something that the Council will decide when we
approve the budget, but it is probably not going to vary too
much from what the Mayor proposed.
Mr. Greenbaum: I understood what you said. It took me a while
to understand what the surplus represents is. I heard Mr.
Jones clap when you talked about using the surplus and lets
worry about next year, next year. I don't think that is a
reasonable approach, and it is not the approach I take in
regards to my review of the budget. I would rather cut costs,
than add to the budget. If you cut costs, it is a win win.
If you add to the budget you have done nothing except deplete
your savings account. My view is lets see where we can cut
it out of the budget and try to get it back down to zero rather
than add additional money in for the funding which has been
President Scapicchio: Anyone else from the Public?
Buddy Shakespeare, Budd Lake: I just wanted to say I was
told to come to the meeting tonight in reference to Turkey
Brook and just the opposite of what I thought was going to
happen happened. I am sure everybody has a job in this room
on the Council and everybody has demands. My job is demanding
too. My other three jobs that I do I don't get paid for. I
have to prepare for those jobs just as though it was a job
that I would get paid for. So I would hope that in the next
coming week we could come here next Tuesday and not have a
lot of discussion and arguments over different issues for
Turkey Brook and possibly that you could be prepared when
you come in here to go forth with this project. It is an important
project, Mt. Olive is always the last to get done with something.
Two years ago we started moving in this direction and since
that time Randolph has already put together a new facility
that would make Turkey Brook look no to good in what's accomplished
over there. Thank you.
President Scapicchio: Thank you Buddy. Anyone else from the
Public? Seeing none, we will close the Public Portion of this
meeting. We have an executive session that was requested by
the Administration. Sherry is the issue personnel?
Mrs. Jenkins: Yes
President Scapicchio: We will take no action when we come
out of executive Session except to adjourn the Public Portion
of the meeting.
Mr. Guenther made a motion to go into Executive Session and
Mrs. Miller seconded the motion.
Meeting reconvened at 9:50pm. Motion made to go into Executive
Session. Following executive session a Motion was made for
Adjournment. All in Favor, none opposed. The Meeting was Adjourned
at 10:14 pm.
I, LISA M LASHWAY, Township Clerk of the Township of Mount
Olive do hereby certify that the foregoing Minutes is a true
and correct copy of the Minutes approved at a legally convened
meeting of the Mount Olive Township Council duly held on May
Mt. Olive Township Clerk